Inside School Choice Advocacy with Dr. Shaunette Parker

Nathan Sanders: All right, welcome back. This is Sunday School Choice, where faith meets education freedom. My name is Nathan Sanders, the host of this fun podcast, and today I’m delighted to be joined by Dr. Shaunette Parker. Dr. Parker is based out of Aiken, South Carolina. She wears lots of hats. She is the Senior Director of Partner Relations at the National School Choice Week Foundation, and she is also the board chair for the Second Baptist Preparatory School in South Carolina there.

So she’s done some awesome work. So Dr. Parker, thanks for joining me today.

Dr. Shaunette Parker: Thank you for having me. I’m always excited to engage in good conversation about school choice.

Nathan Sanders: Amen to that. Well, I’ll let you start, Dr. Parker, to kind of introduce yourself, who you are, what you do, a little bit more than the introduction.

Dr. Shaunette Parker: Yeah, I’ll try to keep it brief, right? Because there’s so much, I forget all the different hats that I wear. So yes, you said it, I’m with the National School Choice Awareness Foundation.

That’s, I guess, first and foremost, where the goal is to be able to just raise awareness about education choice and to spread information through communities, making sure that parents have access to the different education options and information about options and information about support programs, so those financial programs that will help them access those options. So that’s, like, I guess, my big job. And then my labor of love being the board chair at Second Baptist Christian Preparatory School.

It’s a really great alignment because the school itself was one of the, I guess, examples that we were using here in South Carolina as we were working to get the ESA pass, which here we call it our Education Scholarship Trust Fund. And so it was great that I had that personal relationship with the school and being able to have that insider information about how small schools work and showing this as an example that it would benefit from an ESA type program. So both of it goes together.

So it’s always great when I can do my professional job and then still feel like I’m working my job and kind of feel like I’m getting paid from the volunteer work. But yeah, so all in all, I guess, ultimately, what I do is really just wanting to support families out there who are just trying to find the best options for their children.

Nathan Sanders: Yeah, absolutely. It’s never work when you’re having fun and you’re doing something you love. And I think that’s very, it’s very cliche to say that, but I think it’s very true.

Sure. So with both of your leadership roles, the education route and the ministry route, tell me a little bit about how you got into both of those and where they started to intersect.

Dr. Shaunette Parker: Well, I guess it’s interesting. I mean, it’s hard. My path to being in the space of education is a long one.

I mean, because I, you know, just by trade and trained, I had my undergraduate degree in telecommunications, and then I went into psychology, and my PhD is in educational psychology, but I’ve always used that in an education space. And I think early on, I always considered myself an educator, even when I was working in afterschool programs. So the YMCA and the Boys and Girls Clubs and all of those things.

And I think with that, just being who I am as a person and being a woman of faith and being, you know, Christian, it was just, I never separated the two. And I always feel like that that’s important for me. And it’s great that I am in a space where I can just walk that walk, and I don’t have to have this like separation of church and state, right?

So it was always there for me. But I think more in a professional way, how did it lead that way? I think I’ve just always been passionate about education being the great equalizer in communities.

And so my focus in the psychology world, especially is looking at whole children, whole families all around. And when we’re working with, you know, pathologies, and working with mental health disorders and issues and things, a lot of it still ties back to education. And oftentimes, families may have mental health challenges as a result of a lack of education, a lack of awareness.

So the two kind of converge nicely for me. And then I’ve always just been in a space where the church has been a leader in my community. The church is what brings people to education and business and industry.

And oftentimes, the church is used as that space to have those discussions about economics or have those discussions about, you know, politics and different things. So to me, it’s a natural fit that the church being this place where people, they trusted, they will convene, they will go to no matter how crazy the gets. We usually find ourselves in churches, those who believe, right?

And regardless of the denomination or faith that you have, your church or that faith-based space is often the place where you go to get answers. So to me, it just makes sense that if we trust our church so much for different things, we should be trusting them to educate our children and hopefully have that layer of faith added to it so that you can feel good about where you’re sending your kids to school.

Nathan Sanders: Yeah. Oh, I love that so much. And you’re absolutely right.

It seems like, at least in the history of modern world, the church was always used as a town hall. That was where the community and the congregations gathered to learn about things going on in the community, in the world, and social issues and things like that. So I don’t see, to your point, I don’t see how education’s any different, right?

If you care about these kids and you care about ministry and faith, then why not the church step up and say, well, we can do this as well? So as the board chair of a school like Second Baptist Prep, what do you see as sort of unique strengths that the school has, specifically being a church-based school, sort of in the world of public schools and other types of non-religious private schools and home schools? What do you see as some, and it could be even specific to your school, exactly your school.

Dr. Shaunette Parker: Well, I think one, we have the strength of the church community who they see it as a ministry, even though we’re educating children. But I think even when the church was first started, so it’s been almost 30 years now, and it started as a summer camp, with kids in the church basement. And it was the pastor at the time was like, we’re just going to bring them together in the summer, give them some enrichment.

And then when it was time to go back to school, the families were like, well, we want to stay here. We want you to stay here and to take care of them. So there was a strength in safety and feeling like this was a good place for our kids.

But I also think then we have educators from all walks of life to go to the church. And so initially we’re able to utilize this, that spirit of volunteerism and looking at the school as a ministry. And so we got a lot of great support from the church body.

So I think that’s what it is. It’s like sometimes when traditional schools are looking for parents to come in and volunteer, and they’re looking for, you have to do certain hours and all these community volunteers, it’s hard to get them to come. But our being a part of the church, they’re like, no, it’s a part of what we do.

And it’s one of our ministries, and we’re going to come and garden for you all, or we’ll clean up the yard, or we’ll, you know what I mean? Yes, we’ll read to the kids. So I think it’s a strength in just being connected to that church community.

And they automatically see it as this is our school. We’re going to support our school. We’re going to volunteer.

We’re going to donate items to them. But I also just think then that we’re able to tap into all of the professionals and people who come to our school. So not even just educators, you know, all the business professionals and people, and they don’t see it as robbery to give back to the school, because they’re like, well, of course.

It’s most like this unspoken obligation, even though I would hope that most of the congregants don’t feel like they are obligated and they have to serve in a certain way. But that is part of most churches’ mission saying, find some way to serve, find some way to give back. And so we just have a plethora of people who are willing to sow a seed into the kids.

So I just think that definitely takes it far for us.

Nathan Sanders: Yeah, I agree. And I’m not a parent myself, but I know for a lot of parents, you probably get a lot of that connection from just being so close to the operations of it, because the church has to be so involved, not only with the resources you put into the labor, like you said, with volunteering and things like that, but also the actual funding and money that goes into it. Oftentimes, there’s nothing longer than a church business meeting and you’re ready to go home.

But it’s necessary because the church has to decide, hey, how are we going to be good stewards of this money that the church has? And so, yeah, no, I think that’s great. So with that, so why do you believe then, and it could be for those specific examples, and we don’t have to repeat it, but just I guess if someone were to stop you on the street and say, hey, why should our church in anywhere in America start this church-based school?

Dr. Shaunette Parker: Number one, I just think just churches in general, it’s about character development. I mean, I think, and like I was saying, and not focus on trying to push any type of religion, any type of denomination, because even though we are Second Baptist Christian Preparatory School, we utilize the Holy Bible, we focus on that, the children go through devotionals, they pray, we open the school to anybody who just wants a safe space for their kids to learn. You don’t have to be Christian.

Yes, some of those principles will be there, but it doesn’t have to be. I think very much similar to when we think of a parochial Catholic school, you know, anyone can come here, doesn’t matter what your religion is, but what you’re going to get is this safe, caring support, a nurturing environment. I’m not saying, because I’m an educator first, I’ve taught in all different types of schools, public charter, you know, virtual schools, MAGA, all these different places, and I’m not saying that those people don’t exist in those schools, but you have the freedom to show up 100% in your faith in that school, and it adds a different layer of just comfort and support, and you’ll be able to really focus on the children, and they take a different kind of care, and there’s, you know, I mean, that’s at least been my personal experience, and I would say so then, a church being able, like, why should you start a school in your community? Because you are the safe space for your community. You are that neutral space, and that’s what we want first and foremost for our children.

I think that as a parent, and I have six children, three grandchildren, that is number one. I want my child to feel safe. I want my child to feel loved.

I want them to feel comfortable in that environment, and I’ve just noticed that schools that are connected to the church, it’s almost like automatic. It does something to the culture. I think that, you know, you come in, and it’s, you know, like, if you walk into a building, and you tend to dress a certain way, at least most people automatically are like, okay, is this appropriate to walk in this building?

Should I be this way? Do I have to behave this way? So I feel like when people come into a school that they know is connected to a church, there’s this automatic kind of culture shift of what’s appropriate in this space versus when you go to your very traditional public spaces or schools.

I mean, kind of similar to where if you go to a public university versus a private Christian university, the culture and feel feels different. So I would just say, and I don’t want to send the message to anyone saying that, you know, the private Christian schools are better than anyone. That’s not the message that I’m trying to send here, but if a parent is looking for that, if that is of concern, that’s why, and I think that’s why we need to at least have them as an option in cities to where people can go to, regardless of their denomination, because I think I found that most people who come to a faith-based school feel like, they’re like, oh, this isn’t my faith, this isn’t my denomination, but I love that my child goes here, and I’m okay with that. And they almost look at the education and whatever religious teachings as just another form of education.

They put it in a pocket of, it’s no different than if I were to learn history in a history class. I don’t have to believe everything and side with everything, but I’m learning a new piece of information. Yeah.

Nathan Sanders: One of my favorite stories to tell, and I’ve actually probably told this story on this certain podcast for earlier episodes, is one of my first school tours, it was a town called Opelousas in Southwest Louisiana, and it was a private Christian school. We were walking through the halls, meeting all the kids, and this is an underserved community. Most of these parents and these families that sent their kids to school, it was about safety, right?

It was about things other than academics, although academics are important, but it was about safety, first and foremost. But I remember walking through the hallways and looking at all the artwork and projects that the students had been doing, and they were doing, actually did a project on school choice. It was coincidentally, they didn’t do it just for us, but it was I Love School Choice, and I believe it was a National School Choice Week prompt thing.

It was I Love School Choice because, and most of them were, I Love School Choice because I can read the Bible at school. I Love School Choice because I can go to chapel at school and sing. It was a bunch of stuff like that.

And so to your point, these kids are, one, coming in because of things like safety, but you’re able to give them access to the ministry in which you’re offering as a church-based school. Shifting gears here, I want to talk to you because you’re in South Carolina. As you said in your intro, you guys have the ESTF program, the Education Savings Trust Fund program, recently revisited in the state legislature and the General Assembly to try to fix some of the constitutional concerns that the courts had last year.

We won’t get into that rabbit hole, but just kind of updating everyone. But you guys have the program as of now per the legislature. So from your vantage point as a school leader in South Carolina, how do programs like the ESTF program benefit schools like you and benefit families that you serve?

Dr. Shaunette Parker: Absolutely. I always tell people it gives people an opportunity to access elite education without an elite cost, right? Because there is this myth that our ESTF Education Scholarship Trust Fund is targeted toward only certain people and only a small amount of people will be able to access it.

And there’s this myth to them that if you’re using it toward private education, it’s excluding a lot of different people and it’s only trying to keep the rich rich and keep certain people away from different schools. And that’s not it at all. It really opened the door.

And I’ll add and say that it just so happens that Second Baptist Christian Prep happens to be primarily African American. And it’s not that we’re choosing to be that way, but it’s connected to the church. We know how churches go.

Oftentimes they are, you know, very, like one type of Black church, White church. I hate to put them in those labels because we don’t even necessarily consider ourselves a Black school, although we are unapologetic in that we lean into that. That is who our community is and we’re supporting it.

And so to add to that layer, then you have oftentimes a lot of Black families who cannot access private education, right? And so what it has done is it’s opened the door for that for a school like Second Baptist Christian Prep who does cater to a underserved, under-resourced community to be able to open their doors to more people who would have liked to have accessed education or private education who just couldn’t afford it. And so what the ESAs, what they do for private schools, it opens up the opportunity to serve more people.

It’s not about keeping certain people away from the type of education that you want to access. It’s about saying, you know what, we all deserve this opportunity. Let’s be fair here.

And we know, and through research and seeing that students who have been able to really access some great programming through their K-12 education have varying opportunities, they are a step above. And so we’re wanting to have that. And ESA aids in the expansion of schools.

SBC Prep is a small school. We don’t see more than 100 kids usually each year. It’s intentional to be kind of that way.

But what I do see on the horizon, if the ESA continues to stay and everything, that we can grow, not because it’s giving money to the school directly, but because we have so many more families who then who would be able to access it and we can do more and open that up. So yeah, it’s huge.

Nathan Sanders: Yeah. I mean, a universal school choice program, oftentimes opponents and skeptics and advocates for school choice go back and forth. But I think one thing that often goes unnoticed, but what’s so important for folks like you is it provides stability for schools, right?

Administrators in schools chiefly obviously care about the kids and the families. But from an administrative standpoint, they need stability. They need to know that this money for these families is going to be available next year, right?

Can the school budget for this? And so to your point about these expansive programs for every kid and it allows you to grow, schools have to know what that stable growth looks like and if it’s going to be there next year. And so I think that’s super important.

Awesome. Well, we’re coming up on 20 minutes, but I do want to ask you a couple more questions so we can do a quick back and forth. So in your role as Senior Partner Relations with National School Choice, I haven’t asked anyone this on this podcast yet, but I’m interested, what national trends are you seeing that you can kind of think are interesting, if any or at all?

I just wanted to get your thoughts on this.

Dr. Shaunette Parker: Well, I mean, I guess the biggest national trend is just the growth of all of these, the scholarship programs, you know what I mean? Your ESAs, your EST, whatever people want to call them, right?

Nathan Sanders: School choice.

Dr. Shaunette Parker: You know, school choice. Well, and so for me though, I do pull away from making that synonymous with the word school choice because I always want parents to know that you have school choice. If you have more than one school offering, school choice really is about a parent making a decision about where they want to send their child to get educated.

If they’re going to go to a public school, traditional or public charter, traditional public school, magnet, virtual, whatever that is, that’s choice. It’s the ESAs, that’s being able to access the choice programs, right? And so those are the trends.

And the biggest trend right now is trying to move to universal. I think many states have gotten over the hump in terms of they may have, initially the bills were about serving students with special needs or serving military families or serving lower income families. I think now that we’ve seen it happen in many states to where it works, it’s not like this big exodus from traditional education, that these are drops in a bucket when it comes to the amount of money that is spent on the budgets.

I mean South Carolina Department of Ed or the traditional school system, like a 500 million or dollar budget, if not more. I could be misquoting that. So what we’re asking for is pennies, right, to go there.

But the biggest trend then is saying, okay, you see how it works, you see it’s not pulling away, let’s consider universal. Let’s consider opening this up to not just people who, you know, are lower income or special needs and that it’s only fair that we just have this as an option. And trust parents, right?

Trust parents to know that they’re going to send them to the best place. Not every parent is going to feel like a private school is good for their child. I have six.

They all went to different types of schools, you know what I mean? I treat each individual child differently. So yeah, I think that’s the biggest trend is just the really trying to get more of these types of programs and getting people to be aware about what’s out there.

Nathan Sanders: Yeah, I could not have said that better myself. I do think that’s a really important point, you know, when it comes to the implementation of these programs. After they’re passed, the biggest thing is awareness, getting the word out there to all these different types of communities and towns and states like, hey, this is available to you.

Utilize it. Like, if you want it, utilize it. Okay, last question.

Dr. Parker, I’ve asked this almost every guest I’ve had on. This is the last question. What is any advice to families and both church leaders and pastors who are maybe on the fence about starting your school or some type of education ministry, and they just need that extra push?

What would you tell them as your advice?

Dr. Shaunette Parker: Well, first to the church leaders and pastors, I would say, call your church, ask them, find out, really look at what your church body is, and see what you could be missing. Even if you don’t decide to get out there and start a school, how could you incorporate education more in your church programming? So whether that is in your Sunday school services or your vacation Bible school and different things, or even just offering up your church space as a safe space for tutoring and parents to come, or even if it’s just a place where parents can have conversations about education.

So I would just even offer up, just get more involved in what’s happening in your community in terms of just education and looking at the schools and seeing what they can do, even if you’re just pushing your church congregants to go in and volunteer in the traditional schools. That’s like my biggest advice. We can’t, we have to be community churches.

We can’t be a church that’s just there for people on Sundays or Saturday, depending on when you worship. It has to be something that you’re ingrained in the community. And I think for parents, the biggest advice is keep your eyes and ears open, listen to what’s happening from a legislative standpoint and locally.

You are your biggest advocate for your child. You know your child, put your child first, don’t compromise on what you need. I think we have to go into these schools and tell schools what we want for our children and what our expectations are.

And that’s usually what I’m telling parents to put that out there. And so even when you’re going to a faith based school, you know what I mean? Just going in and saying, this is what I hope to have.

This is what I want. I do care. I think unfortunately there’s this myth that parents don’t care about their children’s education.

I feel like we see it more in a private school because it is so more, much more family oriented and it’s smaller. You know what I mean? You can do these one-on-one conversations.

You know what I mean? You can tell when certain parents are missing from a, you know, parent meetings and things like that versus a really large school. But I just think speak up is what I would tell parents and don’t be afraid to ask for things.

Share those ideas with your pastors and say, how can you as a church support this? Everything at church doesn’t have to be about how much money we can give to the church, but then it’s like, so church, what are you giving back to the community? And what are you giving to my child’s education?

And there’s so much more that our churches can do when it comes to education.

Nathan Sanders: That’s awesome. That was beautiful. Thank you so much for that.

Dr. Parker, thank you for joining me today. I wish we could go on for an hour, but we’ll definitely have to have you back on for a part two. But just thank you for what you do in your advocacy.

Thank you for what you do for ministry and for kids. I think it’s one of the most important things that we can do. So we appreciate you, Dr. Parker. And thanks for joining me today.