Dr. Susan Pendergrass breaks down public school district lines and open enrollment with Mike McShane on his What’s Up series.
Mike McShane: Hello and welcome back to another edition of EdChoice Chats. This is Mike McShane, director of National Research at EdChoice, and it is my great privilege today to talk on the podcast with Dr. Susan Pendergrass. She is the Director of Education Policy at the Show-Me Institute. She’s a longtime friend of EdChoice, a brilliant scholar, a wonderful writer, a great conversationalist, and we will be talking about a new paper she has out with us at EdChoice. It’s entitled, “Breaking Down Public School District Lines: Policies, Perceptions, and Implications of Inter-District Open Enrollment”.
If you all have been hearing about open enrollment, I know it’s on offer in lots of states right now that they’re debating these programs or your state might be one of the states that already offers some kind of enrollment across district lines, there’s lots of bends and weaves in the story here because these programs look differently in different states. And luckily Susan will sort me out on all of the questions that I have about this, that some of you may have as well. But you may be in a state that is debating this currently or currently has it. And if you’ve ever had any questions about it, our conversation today and Susan’s paper could definitely help answer them. So without further ado, here’s my conversation with Susan Pendergrass about her new paper with EdChoice on open enrollment in American Public Schools.
So Susan, this term open enrollment, I have found when I Google it almost inevitably tries to get me to enroll in healthcare. It’s mixed, it’s sort of like something happened with education savings accounts, a similar term where they’ve meant something else in different places. So for people that are interested in open enrollment in the way that you’re talking about it in your paper, what is open enrollment? What are open enrollment policies?
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Yeah, sure. So we have gotten into decades ago, a hundred years ago, let’s say, began to be the case that as communities put together their public schools, they had to begin to demarcate who’s part of their district and who’s not part of their district. At one point a hundred years ago, we had a hundred thousand school districts, and each had about a school or two, pretty small. And towards the middle of the last century, we consolidated a bunch of those because they were districts, but they kind of were just schools. And we created these school districts, which made sense at the time during the sort of progressive movements of when they’re building Model T Ford’s, it kind of made sense, let’s get it all under one roof and we’ll have a superintendent and we’ll administer this thing and we’ll be able to offer more classes and we’ll make it a district and you draw lines around it and pay your property taxes to your local school district, and that’s how they’re funded.
Well, that’s changed so much. It started changing, honestly, with Brown v. Board of Education. Started changing when it became clear that some districts had a ton of property wealth and some had hardly any property wealth. And so it became, well, this isn’t really fair because some school districts are poor and can’t raise much money and they have terrible educational offerings and buildings and everything, and then some are really wealthy and they’re basically expensive private schools.
And so we’ve been trying, we collectively, the federal government and all state governments have, we’ll be the ones that will sort of even this out and we’ll create these funding formulas and we’ll try to take money from this one and give it to this one. And we will from above try to right the ship and make it more fair for everybody. And what’s really emerged in 1990-ish, so let’s say 35 years ago, 89 in Minnesota is “Hey, what if instead of us trying to equalize the resources, we just let people go to the school that they choose?”
And these district lines that got created and sort of really hardwired into the system become less meaningful because where you live, there’s going to be a certain number of schools within a radius of what you feel is acceptable distance to travel for your child to go to school. And you’re going to have a certain number of schools in there and you ought to be able to just pick any of them. So Minnesota did this 35 years ago. They’re, you can take your state funding, pick a school in your school district or pick a school out of your school district. And at this point, 43 other states have followed suit. And in 20-some it is mandatory, which means that districts have to accept transfer students and they have to let kids leave.
So the states where it’s not mandatory, where it’s voluntary, it’s kind of iffy because you run into situations where the wealthier districts are, we’re not going to take kids. We can’t stop kids from leaving, we won’t take kids. So now you have open enrollment. And so in Wisconsin you’ve got some 80,000 kids choosing it. I think it ends up Minnesota, you get to sort of a 10 percent sort of critical mass of kids who… which is to say 90 percent of kids are still going to go to their neighborhood school. It’s sort of how we are used to operating with our kids is you either move to this neighborhood that you want to for the school, or you fall in love with your neighborhood school or your child goes to the school you went to.
So most kids are still going to their neighborhood school, but you have this 10 percent or so that are willing to make some sacrifice through transportation or something to pick a different school. So it’s called open enrollment, which just means we open up the district borders, we open up those lines around the schools, and we let people pick rather than being assigned.
Mike McShane: Well, that’s great. So, one of the questions I really wanted to ask you was how these policies vary across states. And you mentioned a couple of them there that I think would be interesting to dive into. So, one of them is around this idea of requiring districts to allow students to come in and leave. Is that a blanket requirement? Is it that districts have to say anybody who wants to come in can come in? Or is it saying we have X number of seats available? How exactly does it work, is it truly sort of open borders or is it sort of porous but with some limits on it? How does that work?
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: So sort of porous is the answer, and in every case a district can say, oh, no, we don’t have enough seats available, so we can’t take kids in that grade, in that school or in that program in that school. And in the best cases, like Arizona districts post for each school grade and program how many open seats they have, and they update it quarterly so that if they say ahead of time we have ten fourth grade seats in this highly coveted elementary school, then may the best man… no, it’s like a first come first serve and then a wait list.
But in the worst version of that, somebody applies for a fourth grade seat and they go, oh, we don’t have any fourth grade seats. So the way it should happen is that they post ahead of time how many open seats they have in each school grade in program. And by program, I include disability programs or programs specialized magnet programs for the arts with sciences or something like that. You have to post them ahead of time so that parents know that there’s an opening that they can apply for.
And so what you see in the voluntary states is, okay, well what we know, and you haven’t asked this question, but parents tend to pick a higher performing school over a lower performing school. So you’re in a low performing school district, you can’t move or you don’t want to move for any number of reasons, you’re going to pick a higher performing school district. And in those cases, what we’ve seen, and I think it’s more like as these programs initially roll out before folks in the system sort of become accustomed to the new set of rules is they don’t want to bring in the lower performing kids and have them affect their test scores, right?
It’s like that’s going to water down because I think that there’s not confidence that their programs are so outstanding that every child will do well there. It’s like, well, I don’t know, we’ve got this nice group of kids, we’ve got great test scores, we’re not sure, we just want to open up our borders to anybody coming in. And you do see that there’s kind of a well-known graphic of Ohio where you see the higher performing urban districts do not let in kids from the lower performing surrounding areas.
So it is not really with fidelity when you have an open enrollment program where districts can opt out. But again, about half the states in the country is mandatory. They have to let kids come in and let kids go out. And I think we’re seeing growth in it. And I also think that as the charter school sector has grown, as private school choice programs have grown, especially in the last couple years, we have now four states that are just letting parents pick any school essentially; Arizona, West Virginia, Utah, and Iowa. And a couple more that could happen this year. And as more parents are second generation school choosers, I think that the idea is no longer controversial. It’s accepted in lots of places and it’s just part of the landscape in many states.
Mike McShane: So how does the money work? So, does that child bring funding with them? Is it the same amount that they otherwise would have in that district? You mentioned maybe some of these districts that have higher property taxes and so they’re funded at a higher level. Do they get their sending districts property taxes? How does that work?
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Yeah. So there’s lots of different ways that it can work, and there’s multiple forms of this policy across the country. But generally speaking, these foundation formulas have some component based on enrollment or attendance. And so if you’re counted over here at your assigned public school, but then you choose to go over here, you become counted in the enrollment over here and then whatever your state’s formula is, foundation formula, then you become part of the foundation formula for the new district. So you bring with you kind of your state funding and it’s based on your new district rather than your old district.
That’s kind of the less than ideal one because if you think about it, wealthy districts probably get less money per student from the state because they’re more locally funded. So it makes these kids less attractive. And so there’s an incentive not to take them. Now Wisconsin has a really interesting system whereby they just fund open enrollment kids really and the legislature picks a dollar amount, that it’s around $8,200. And if you’re in the open enrollment program, you bring $8,200 with you regardless of where you came from or where you went to or where you go to.
And then there’s multipliers for students with disabilities. And if you’re a more expensive student, then it can be more money than that. But they just carve them out of the system completely, which I think is the ideal because number one, Wisconsin also does a good job of tracking kids and where they are assigned to and where they chose to go and how many applications are being received, how many are being refused, how many are being accepted. They have a really good data tracker, and then the funding for it is just a lot simpler. It’s just clean. It’s like you have your open enrollment dollar amount and every district knows that that’s what those kids bring with them, and it’s higher than the state-based funding. So there’s a little bit of an incentive to accept kids.
Mike McShane: Because that seems to me one of the challenges that could arise is this sort of adverse selection problem. I think of it in health insurance or whatever, health insurance companies want younger, healthier people that are going to pay their premiums but not extract anything in payouts and want to avoid people who have expensive health conditions but don’t pay as much in premium. So it seems like one way around it is to just require it and say, even if you’re not getting money from these kids, doesn’t matter, you have to take them. But that seems like not the nicest negotiation taking place between two parties. It sounds like in other places there are ways to do it, just on the financial side.
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Those kids could move into the district, right? They could move into the district and rent and not pay property. I see this with private school choice programs too. It’s like they leave and take the money. I’m, well, they kids move states all the time. Kids move districts, they move out of state, move out of the country, kids move around all the time and they come and they go. And so for some reason, if they go or if they come in from another district, there’s a tendency to want to treat those children differently when in fact they could rent an apartment in your district and you would get no property taxes and there they would be and you would be responsible for that.
So I think that what you see in states and this paper that’s coming out, there’s sort of in-depth looks at four states and a state like Arizona, which has had open enrollment for a long time and all kinds of other choice, it’s a very open system in Arizona now, the wild west of school choice, you see the supply side respond. So Phoenix has opened a school with a really cool bioscience program in order to attract kids from out of the district. You also see in rural areas, districts with declining enrollment, it’s iffy as to whether they’re going to be able to keep their school open or continue to have a high school. If you have open enrollment, they can pull from other districts and it can be a shot in the arm for districts that sort of lean into it rather than leaning away from it.
And also in states with open enrollment, Ohio’s an example of this, you can have consortia of small school districts where they’re, okay, well we can’t be everything to everyone, but we could be the ag program and this could be the STEM program and this could be the arts program, and then you can stick with your base school. There’s lots of ways around this where what you’re doing is creating opportunities for families to have more options, and then you’re allowing the schools to specialize and improve and serve students better. The current system is you draw a circle around the school, that’s your catchment zone. Everyone who lives in there has to go there. And that school has to pretend to serve each and every kid who happens to live within that circle to the best degree that they could be served. And we know that doesn’t work, right?
Mike McShane: No, that’s one of those things I was thinking, things that as I was reading your paper that made me think, and one of them was this kind of idea of, well, it seems kind of nuts to expect every school to be everything for everyone. And instead having some sort of system where schools can offer different things, they can emphasize different things, they can teach different things in different ways, all of those things. And allowing people to find the one just because it’s a herculean task to say, yep, no, everybody that lives in here, you’ve got to be the right choice for them. Seems like a wild idea to me.
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: That’s right. And you can go through the list of things, and I often do, but the school might be too big or too small. You talk to people when they look at colleges, they’re, oh, they have to go to a small school, or they have to go to a big school. We have these ideas of what we have to have in college. It could be too big, too small. Sometimes kids get on the wrong side of teachers and they just feel like they can’t get out from under it. That could be a reason. Sometimes they’re bullied by kids. That could be a reason. Sometimes if you have an IEP, your school may not be able to… imagine you’re a small rural high school and a student shows up with a disability that you haven’t served before, like a blind student, now you have to hire staff, you have to invest resources. Does that make sense to try to retrofit the school to take care of every possible child’s situation or should we let the kids move around so that the schools could specialize a little bit?
And I think that’s exactly what you see in these open enrollment programs. And also, like I said in the beginning, these are the unhappy kids. These are the kids for whom the school is not working. I don’t think when you open up open enrollment, there’s this fear… we’re talking about open enrollment in Missouri, so all the fears are being put out there, there’s this fear that everyone’s just going to go, great, I’m going to move schools, fantastic. I’m going to look down the list and pick a school. That is not what happens. You do have to invest a little bit of effort. You do have to figure out the transportation piece. Your kids will not go to school with the kids in the neighborhood. And that’s a cost for some folks. You know what I mean?
They may not go to school then with the kids in their Girl Scout troop or whatever. You know what I mean? It’s not everybody is up for that. These are the people who are, this is worth the cost to me because I really want this benefit because where my child is going to school right now is not a good fit. I just don’t think you see people sampling schools and moving around for the sake of moving around.
Mike McShane: Another thing your paper made me think of was about this kind of role of school districts in general. Because it seems to me when you’re describing all these policies, states have to build this kind of Rube Goldberg device of, well, we still have the property tax funding, but then we got to count the kids and we’ll do as sending and a receiving and whatever. In some ways, does this make you think about the future or the present? Is it maybe of school districts?
As you mentioned, I think quite correctly, they sort of appeared at a particular point in time to solve a particular problem that existed when they were created. Have they outlived their usefulness? Is that a bridge too far? And it’s more, we don’t need to go that far or whatever? As you survey all of these things, what do you think about just the role of school districts?
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Yeah, I think they were beginning to out serve their usefulness. The federal government does a national household education survey every couple of years. Then they ask people, does your child attend an assigned public school, a chosen public school, a private school or homeschool, an amazing percentage, get it wrong, which is fine. But they ask both these questions and then there’s a follow-up question of did you move to the neighborhood you live in because of your school? So they’re trying to get at that.
Well, the percentage of parents who report their children attend assigned public schools, it was in the 90 percentiles up there and it’s like 67, 68. It’s two-thirds. So you’re already, I think we’re seeing this very slow-moving change where people are more expecting to pick a school than to be assigned to a school. And I would say that is true throughout all aspects of society. You used to go to the doctor, you were told you have cancer, I’m sorry. And you didn’t question and now people are on the internet figuring out their own stuff.
So I think the idea of being assigned was slowly losing favor. And then obviously it was a shot in the arm, COVID, the shutdown of the schools. And then people were really mad, and I assume this happened with you as well, people who selected and bought houses in the best school districts, and they were mad that they closed or they were mad that their kids had to have a vaccination or they were mad that the kids had to wear masks or they did not like the quarantine policy or they did not like the plexiglass boxes. Whatever it was, they’re, I chose this school and I don’t like it. And it’s, yeah, that’s how people have been feeling in some of our worst school districts. And that’s what it feels like to be assigned to a school that doesn’t work for you.
So it’s a much broader issue now. And EdChoice does the monthly polling. The one thing that I think is interesting, and I know this, you worked on this a lot, is the percentage of parents who want their kids home a couple days. They don’t want them home every day, they don’t want them gone every day, but they want them home a couple days. And we don’t have a school system built for that. That is not the design of our system. A lot of parents are starting their own schools. I did a podcast on microschools. We have all these new versions coming out, hybrid homeschooling, what you’ve talked about a lot. And I think what we’re finding is parents want more choices and not fewer. So this idea that you’re just going to look at your utility bill and go, oh, that’s where my child goes to kindergarten, I guess I think was a losing favor. And now it’s really a lost favor.
Also, at the same time, you’ve got this backlash against school boards, hard to get people to run for the school board now. You’ve got some parents, some vocal groups of parents getting very involved in curriculum fights and things like that. And it just seems very contentious. And teachers unions are fighting against parents and who’s in control of school and who owns the kids. And I think with all of that, there’s an opportunity to sort of rethink this at the systematic level.
Mike McShane: Well, yeah, because you think of the degree to which having that one district just pours gasoline on all of those fires, every one of those decisions because they have to apply to everyone. Everyone’s learning the same curriculum. Everyone is sitting in a plexiglass box or everyone is masked or everyone is unmasked or whatever, or the schools are open or the schools are closed. It wasn’t like, oh, well, it’ll be true for some people and not others. And people who are comfortable or uncomfortable or think one thing should think others.
And I think this is one of these things, it’s, I think quite fairly, it raises the stakes. It’s like if that’s your kid and that’s the only school they can go to and you’re worried that they’re in danger or that you’re worried that they’re being taught something that’s wrong or harmful, you get where it’s, oh yeah, people get really fired up about this. But then there is that sort of frustrating bit where it’s, well, one way to channel that frustration rather than continuing to bang your heads against one another is to try and look for off ramps. How do we dial this down a bit? How do we find opportunities to go other places so we don’t have to continue to have this really fierce arguments with one another?
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Yeah. I’ve heard some pushback on that, don’t just let people leave. They should be working within the system. And plus what’s really hard is you’re already busy and it’s hard enough to just… I think when my youngest was in third grade, because the day was long, and he had a teacher who really believes very strongly in homework, really big believer in homework and I was, look, he’s not going to do the homework because he just can’t at the end of the day, and I’m not going to fight with him every day. And if he’s outside, he’s outside, he’s not going to do the homework. That’s hard as a parent to stand up and say, I appreciate that you’re sending the homework home, he’s not going to do the homework.
To think that you’re going to change things from within to get that school to be the way you need it to be for your kid who’s there for five or six years. Parents are this kind of rolling interest group where your care a lot when your kids are in that system, they move on to college and you care a lot less. Maybe you get grandchildren and maybe you care again for a little bit, but it’s not this hard and fast interest group that lasts forever like the Rotary. This is, you’re kind of in there temporarily.
And it’s hard to change a system like that quickly. And you can try to work on school board elections and things like that, but why not open the system? Why so much resistance to just saying, “Hey, let people go where they want.” Why do we need to defend this institutional structure that might have run its course?
Mike McShane: So now one criticism of open enrollment that I hear, and I think it’s probably a fair one, is the issue around transportation. Just like, well, you can attend any district that you want to, but if you can’t get there, or districts can say, oh yeah, sure, we’ll take anybody. Maybe before we debate the pros and cons of that, what is the status of just the transportation policy of these programs that you looked at? Do most of them, do some of them, do any of them provide transportation for students? How does it actually work?
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Yeah, a lot of them do provide transportation. For example, in Wisconsin, you can get direct funding. The parents can, if you want to drive up to I think $1,200 or $1,300, sometimes they will pick your child up the closest bus stop to your house that’s inside the district. So as soon as you cross that district line, closest bus stop, you could drop them at the bus stop. Some cases they reimburse parents on a per mile basis. But one thing that I think is kind of interesting that I’ve been looking at is bus ridership has been around the 50 percent mark for quite a while, 50, 55 percent. It has declined. I don’t know.
Mike McShane: That’s of public school students. About 50 percent of public school students ride the bus to school.
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Right. And if you think about it, high school students generally will try any other method possible before riding the bus, right? It’s not the 1950s. So a lot of parents drive their kids to school. So I was just kind of curious about this. We are talking a lot about transportation. We don’t want that to be the tail wagging the dog when it often is, be like we can’t have open enrollment because of buses. And it’s like, I think we’re smart enough to figure it out, first of all.
But also, is every kid riding the bus every day still? I don’t think so. In Missouri, we’re down to about 40% ridership and we still have these 75-person yellow buses. Is that the right thing to do in 2023? Probably not. Arizona has a grant program through their A+ grant program where they gave money to people to come up with innovative ideas. And districts have done things like small vans that have wireless and a homework tutor. So if you have to ride the bus for a long time, you get your homework done and there’s a person on the bus that’s not just a bus attendant keeping decorum, keeping everyone from fighting, but actually helping with homework and wireless.
There are ways that we could get around this. If Uber Eats can bring me lunch, I think we can figure out a way to get kids where they need to be. But secondly, I don’t have that much time in my hands, but it’s going to sound like I do. I looked at all the rural high schools in Missouri and I mapped them on Google Maps, the 20 closest drive time and miles, because I’ve heard it said that they’re too far apart for open enrollment to work. It’s an hour. Well, the furthest one is about 30 miles, has another high school within about 30 miles, but over half of them have two high schools within 20 miles.
Now in high school, 20 miles and in rural areas, 20 miles is 20 minutes. In the middle of St. Louis, 5 miles might be 20 minutes, but in a rural area, 20 miles, 20 minutes, it’s kind of up to you if it’s worth it for you. You know this because you did this analysis, a third of our high schools don’t offer calculus. If you would like to drive 20 miles to take calculus, fine. It’s kind of up to you. And I think people would be willing. And also kids are spaced all over those districts so that you might actually be closer to a high school in a different district.
But I think that we could be turning some attention to the transportation issue and finding solutions so that we don’t let that be a roadblock because we have this old system of yellow buses with 75 kids on them and one bus driver, and they go in the morning and they come back in the afternoon. If we could work around that a little bit, I think we could find a solution. And what about the kids who want this hybrid mix? You know what I mean? Maybe we need shuttles. I don’t know. Maybe not every kid’s going to school every day, but we can figure it out.
Mike McShane: Yeah. Full disclosure podcast listeners, I was actually on the advisory board for that Arizona thing that gave out the money. So I reviewed all of the applications for it and everything. And you’re right, it’s sort of like there’s all sorts of things like different nonprofit organizations, cities. Cities could apply, nonprofits could apply, school districts could apply, charter networks could apply. All these private schools could apply, I think. And they all came up with totally different answers.
As an aside, I learned a lot about Arizona. Shout out to anybody from Arizona who’s listening to this about just the varying geography and topography of it and how some of their rural schools have unpaved roads and when it rains, they wash out and they need 4×4’s to get people routes. So it was super interesting. But again, you’re right, it’s, yeah, a 75-seater yellow bus is going to get mired in the mud there. And in other places it’s like, no, we need shorter little 15 passenger vans that can run constantly, or we need to integrate with our local municipality and we can figure out all of these things. But the long and the short of it is, it’s like all of these are imminently answerable questions.
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Absolutely.
Mike McShane: We can figure this out. We’re smart people and we have just these incredible amount of resources and other, not just money, but physical resources. All these buses and all these cars and all these things, there’s enough of them out there to figure it out. But you’re right, yeah, one of these interesting challenges is just trying to get drivers. If you want to have that 75-person school bus and they have to work this weird schedule where they work in the morning and then they have a break and then they work in the afternoons, and so it’s like, yeah, so that’s compounds the problem. It’s like, well, we might need to figure out something else.
But anyway, that’s a diversion. Probably the last question I’ll ask you is sort of forward-looking and someone who’s been looking at the past and present of this, thinking about open enrollment in the next year, 5 years, 10 years, what do you see as the future forward? Do you think it’s going to grow? Do you think it’s going to be less popular? Do you think charter schooling and private school choice are going to supplant it? What do you see in the future?
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: I think it’s going to grow. You’ve got half the states that haven’t really implemented a strong policy. I think that it is an attraction for families and overall nationally, K–12’s enrollment declining. We had a little bubble, the little baby bubble. It’s moved through. There are fewer K–12 students in the United States today than there were 10 years ago, and we’re heading towards even fewer still. And then you have some states, I keep using Missouri because that’s where I work, but declining enrollment, we’re supposed to lose another 10 percent of our enrollment.
So if you want a state that’s attracting families, you’re going to need to offer families what they want and what families want is for each of their children to be able to stop and consider which kindergarten is the kindergarten they want them to go to. Do they want a Montessori or an outdoor school or back to basics, whatever it is, that’s what families want. And the states that sit on the sideline and refuse to open up their district lines are going to be the states that are going to just lose families faster. They’re not going to be very attractive.
And you have these people theoretically, who can move around and work remotely or could until… it seems to be dying right now, but could move around work remotely. You want to be attractive to those families. And again, like I said, you’ve got second generation parents now who are part of school choice and no one I know wants fewer choices than they used to have. I don’t think we’re going to go backwards, so I think it’s going to go… I don’t think it’s going to supplant charter schools unless we completely open up the system to a whole portfolio approach or just a pluralist system of schools where you can have public-private charter.
No one really cares. Parents don’t normally care what the governance structure is right then, and you can just pick any one of them. I think that that is, like I said, four states have done it, several other states are considering it this year, and those are going to be the states that attract families. So I can only imagine that we’ll only grow.
Mike McShane: Well, wonderful place to end it. Susan, thank you so much for taking the time to join us on the podcast today.
Dr. Susan Pendergrass: Thanks for having me.
Mike McShane: Well, I hope you enjoyed that conversation as much as I did. As you can probably tell, I’ve known Susan for a very long time, and I always really enjoy speaking with her, and it’s fun to just record it sometimes. We could have talked for much longer and about the various topics that were in there, but I wanted to sort of stick to the paper because she’s a very interesting person, she has lots of interesting thoughts on a bunch of different areas, but it was like, well, this is the paper that’s coming out, and so this is what we’re going to talk about.
But hopefully we’ll have Susan back on the podcast for a more wide-ranging interview about some of her other thoughts on education policy. But please check out the paper again. It’s called “Breaking Down Public School District Lines: Policies, Perceptions, and Implications For Interdistrict Open Enrollment”. It’s available on the EdChoice website, www.edchoice.org. As always, follow us on social media, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok. We have TikTok. TikTok, we’re still cranking those things out. Mostly the youths that’s affiliated with us. They’re much more native to that. I’m sort of clunky in my TikToking, but I give it the old college try. But check us out on TikTok as well if you’re on there. We try and put out some fun content.
And I really appreciate you all listening. Check out the paper, listen to us again in the future because I look forward to joining all of you on another edition of EdChoice Chats.